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Chris Brown
New member
Username: Welder691
Post Number: 1
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 4.253.114.49
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, April 07, 2005 - 01:27 am: | 
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Hello All,
I am new here and this question probably has been asked a thousand times, so sorry. But I am looking for a new atv. Should I buy an Argo or a Max? I am looking for one to ride out on the trais and for some work around my cousins farm. And also, I will probably build a mower deck and mow the grass. So that would factor in to it. Before I go ahead and buy one, how would I attach a mower deck and a snow plow?
Thanks,
Chris |
david berger
Member
Username: Davidrrrd
Post Number: 34
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 172.151.90.226
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, April 07, 2005 - 04:48 pm: |
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yes chris it has bin asked and will likely be asked again,
as long as it has a big engine any will plow or pull loads,
so the best and only way to decide is to locate and try out each to find out for yourself wich you feal most comfortable,
and yes there are people here on this discussion board who own each!
first try to do a serch with the owner registry serch engine on this site of your state or next state over if your on the line,
then e-mail thouse people who say they want to ride with others and see if any nearby to you would like to give you a test drive, and then also try to get test drives from dealers in your area,
keep an eye out for used vehicle deals in your region too.
you can probly get a test drive from them as well,
after all how else can they sell them right?
it is the only good way to decide,
side by side videos only show you they are cloasely matched,
failing the above theres another posability,
get your but to one of the rideing events listed on events page or advertised on threds here in the discussion board, there you will likely find good examples of all vehicles available for sale these days and willing owners to give you rides in real life adventure as a test drive, you will go home knoweing wich you will buy! |
Jerry R. Nuss
Junior Member
Username: Jerrynuss
Post Number: 18
Registered: 02-2005
Posted From: 66.20.228.224
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, April 07, 2005 - 10:19 am: |
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For the mower most people use a tow behind unit that attached to a ball hitch. The deck has a motor sitting on top of it. They are fairly common.
Argo and Max both have plow kits for their machines and they can be found used too.
Either machine will work for what you have mentioned. It may come down to personal choice and what you like and what kind of support you can find for parts and service.
You should find someone with a machine and go ride with them or do a test drive with a dealer. A good idea is to monitor the board here and show up at one of the rides and get a first hand look at the machines. |
Missouri's Max Dealer (Brandon Price)
Junior Member
Username: Brandon_price
Post Number: 15
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 69.27.205.42
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, April 07, 2005 - 07:15 pm: |
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Chris, We get that question a lot but it's a good one since so many people don't have a dealer in their area. You should check out each brand and take a demo ride. The Max and Argo are as different as two 6x6s can be. Let us know your location and I bet we can find a dealer close to you. I'm in central Missouri.
A mower deck, in my opinion, is out of the question. You cannot mow a nice lawn with a skid steer vehicle in any reasonable conditions. It might work well to have a brush hog type mower to cut a field. Our 6x6's large aggressive tires don't get along with nice lawns when so many turns are needed when mowing. You'll want to make smooth easy turns without skidding when crossing your lawn.
Both Max and Argo sell snowplows for their vehicles. |
Charlie Richmond
New member
Username: Csrichmond
Post Number: 3
Registered: 02-2005
Posted From: 206.66.249.2
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, April 07, 2005 - 09:11 am: |
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Chris, try one and decide which "feels better" to you.
Which dealer is closest/best for you, ARGO or MAX?
ATV's use tow behind mowers that can be ganged up to cover a wide area.
Buy a "factory" snowplow setup and a top so you can plow in relative comfort.
I like the apearance of the ARGO but I bought a used MAX II (that needed a rebuild).
I have a great dealer located not far from where I'll use it in NH.
Now that I have it running again it's really a blast, just like having your own tank.
Good luck. |
Chris Brown
New member
Username: Welder691
Post Number: 2
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 4.253.117.143
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, April 07, 2005 - 03:25 pm: |
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P.S. I am also a fisherman. So that would factor in to. Which on would you guys believe the best in water?
Thanks,
Chris |
fred sain (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 12.168.170.138
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, April 08, 2005 - 09:34 am: |
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Chris, you have been given good advise!!! Test drive!!! No one can tell you which machine that you will like better, they can only tell you which machine they like better. I would think the Max would not tear up the yard quite as bad as the Argo when pulling a mower. |
Jerry R. Nuss
Member
Username: Jerrynuss
Post Number: 19
Registered: 02-2005
Posted From: 66.20.226.1
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, April 09, 2005 - 07:10 am: |
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Don't get the wrong idea on the mowing. You mentioned mowing at a farm so I assumed, maybe incorrectly, you would be doing farm type mowing. Between fields, ditches, around implements, etc. You could mow anywhere you could with a bush-hog. If you are wanting a nice maniculed yard then the turns could do some damage but that would depend on the pattern you are using and what type of tires you have, the type of grass, and how wet the yard is. Some of the runamuck, and chevron tires are going to be much less hard on the yard as some rawhide type tires.
For fishing out of the vehicle that will depend on where you are wanting to fish. Use it to get to a site or fish from the machine? How comfortable you fell moving about in it, flowing water or underwater obstacles like stumps. The best advice has been given go for a test ride and see what you think. Might as well get a test ride in water too. |
Chris Brown
New member
Username: Welder691
Post Number: 3
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 4.253.119.63
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, April 09, 2005 - 12:49 am: |
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Hey Thanks Guys. I have not found a dealer in my area yet. I am located in Steubenville Ohio. Hmmm...maybe I should open my own dealership and sell both! About my location I am 45 minutes west of Pittsburgh Pa. I already contacted Argo from there website. But havent with max yet. And with the mowers, I dont need or want a golf course lawn. Just keep it short! Or brown.....But my mom is looking to get around 7 acres or so. And I dont want to buy a tractor. Or a 4 wheeler. I have always been a little bit different. Thanks for the advice. I think that the closest dealer to me is in Indiana.I would hate to drive that far to test drive one.
Thanks Again,
Chris |
david berger
Member
Username: Davidrrrd
Post Number: 35
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 172.168.173.21
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, April 09, 2005 - 03:25 pm: |
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ok chris but next weekend you could test drive dozens of aatv's at the april rideing event at copper ridge in olean,NY.
it's nearly 15 minutes from ohio(i think)
look it up on events page here on route6x6. |
Chris Brown
New member
Username: Welder691
Post Number: 4
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 4.253.112.136
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, April 11, 2005 - 12:53 am: |
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OOO I did not realize that. Well its probably in the upper north west of PA. Oh well, it would be worth the drive. But how many people out there would let me drive there machines?
Thanks,
Chris |
david berger
Member
Username: Davidrrrd
Post Number: 37
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 172.157.43.235
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, April 11, 2005 - 09:33 am: |
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on this erth you couldent find a friendlyer bunch of straingers,
id say nearly all would be happy to show you the best features of the machines they own, and same folks will often ask you if youd like to try it out,
many are also dealers,
and come to another event and you already will know alot of people, |
Midwest atv's #1 since 2000
Junior Member
Username: Hustler
Post Number: 16
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 64.136.49.229
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, April 11, 2005 - 10:46 am: |
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Chris,
At this ride, I would bet almost everyone will allow you to ride their atv's so you can get a good feel about each one. It would also be good to ride with experience drivers because a good driver can make a huge difference in these atv's. |
Fred Sowerwine, Montana's Max dealer
Member
Username: Fred4dot
Post Number: 49
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 216.166.168.53
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, April 11, 2005 - 10:29 am: |
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Chris, you will be better off just riding with experienced riders if you really want to know what skid steers are capable of. It is impossible for a new user to comprehend what they can do, let alone be able to execute. It takes about fifty hours behind the sticks to learn what works and what doesn't (some of us continue to learn regardless of the hours). With the Max in particular, the more one drives one, the more the machine can do and the more hours on the tranny, the better and smoother it works. How well a skid steer performs is mostly due to the operator - of course PSI on the ground is also important and Max wins hands down in that category (the tracked Avenger is competitive).
One tip: Get the biggest factory supplied tires available and make sure you get solid axles and o-ring chain if you buy a Max (if you want tracks, just plan on two sets of tires). |
John Martin (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 68.12.196.112
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, April 11, 2005 - 11:52 pm: |
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I would also make sure you get splined axles as well so you won't be messing with sloppy bolt holes in your axles later on. |
Chris Brown
New member
Username: Welder691
Post Number: 5
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 4.253.117.84
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 12, 2005 - 02:57 am: |
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Thanks again. But unfourtantly I will not be able to make it to New york this weekend. Its about 7 or so hours away And i have some work to do. I have just recieved some info from the closest Argo dealer, in Indiana. I hope I wont have to drive that far to test drive one when the time comes. I dont have a clue where the nearest Max dealer is. I am in Steubenville Ohio if any one can help.
Thanks,
Chris |
david berger
Member
Username: Davidrrrd
Post Number: 38
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 172.143.96.48
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 12, 2005 - 10:11 am: |
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the max factory is in bufelo,NY.
that might not be too far,
they have testing area behind there facility i understand.
other than that theres another ride at and of april in modina,ny.
can you make it then?
i will be at that one. |
Fred Sowerwine, Montana's Max dealer
Intermediate Member
Username: Fred4dot
Post Number: 50
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 216.166.168.53
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 12, 2005 - 10:01 am: |
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Chris, For a max dealer go to the RI dealer locate page. http://www.maxatvs.com/index.php?submenu=DealerLocator&src=gendocs&link=DealerMa p&category=Main and click on a state. |
Barak (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 69.213.109.12
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 12, 2005 - 09:47 pm: |
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Chris,
Your closest Max dealer is Action Coupling Equipment located at 8249 County Road 245 in Holmesville, OH (Holmes County). Their number is 330.279.4242 I bought a Max IV 950T factory direct from Recreatives and am happy with it. Might want to compare dealer vs factory direct pricing.
-Barak |
Chris Brown
New member
Username: Welder691
Post Number: 6
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 4.253.115.186
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 13, 2005 - 08:08 pm: |
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I mite be able to make that one david. I have checked maxs factory direct. They are having a sale right now. I think 6 grand for the 16 horse. I want at least 18 horse. Would that be big enough? And where is Modina?
Thanks,
Chris |
david berger
Member
Username: Davidrrrd
Post Number: 44
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 172.158.104.51
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, April 14, 2005 - 09:48 am: |
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its near poughkeepsie,NY.
you can do a map quest for 1700-1838 route 44 -55
modena,NY.12548
its eastern newyork near coneticut, |
Fredryck T. Macko
New member
Username: Ftmacko
Post Number: 1
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 205.188.116.13
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, April 18, 2005 - 10:38 am: |
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It took hours to read through this thread. Thanks for all the good information. Soon I will put it all to use in making my choice, but in the meantime let me ask this. The area I hunt is on the Pearl River north of Ross Barnett Reservoir in Madison County, Ms. It is a WMA that I may traverse by water but not by land. ATV's are not allowed on the trails except to retrieve game and that’s after you drag your games through up to ¾ mile of swamp. The "water" consists of large flooded fields, sloughs, and a very limited number of open creeks. Most of the water is from 12" to 36" deep and has a lot of vegetation such as duckweed, cattails, swampgrass, and a variety of small, fast growing but brittle trees. I have concerns whether open wheels could propel the machine when vegetation piles up in front of it or when timber obstructs its path. With this much vegetation, would the best setup be with tracks and rely on an outboard for open water propulsion or would one stick to open wheels. |
Jerry R. Nuss
Member
Username: Jerrynuss
Post Number: 21
Registered: 02-2005
Posted From: 68.156.75.1
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, April 18, 2005 - 02:40 pm: |
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Why do you want to use an atv in these conditions? It sounds more like you would want a boat or even an air boat. You are correct in thinking that small objects like trees and cattails can stop the atv if it is on water and the tires cannot get traction on the bottom. just like a boat it needs a clear path or the ability to climb over partially submerged objects. A supplemental form of propulsion would help such as the outboard. My concern is people often expect too much from the atv. Then when they get one and when it doesn't perform they are unhappy and don't have a good opinion of a very useful vehicle. My concern is it sounds like you don't have much area to ride and would be using it almost exclusively on the water. If this is the case I think you might be disappointed. |
david berger
Member
Username: Davidrrrd
Post Number: 45
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 172.135.234.50
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, April 18, 2005 - 04:25 pm: |
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jery don't worry so much about such obsticles
as a few feet to left or the right thers bound to be a spot you can get out from,
and if the spot you prefer has some brush or something like that you could also simply use your winch for asistance to gain the foothold onto shore,
although most people i know only put winches on for balest, heh heh |
david berger
Member
Username: Davidrrrd
Post Number: 46
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 172.135.234.50
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, April 18, 2005 - 04:38 pm: |
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Fredryck T. Macko
being from that state id think you would already be aquainted with the "GO DEVIL" shalow water boat propultion
http://www.go-devil.com/
so tracks and maybe a go devil are the combo for you.
i could envision a max IV with a go devil toweing a water skier threw a swamp, LOL |
roadwolf (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 65.95.116.100
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, April 21, 2005 - 02:21 am: |
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i would buy a max, as it is a positive six wheel drive. a argo on the other hand has a open differental, which can slip one side and leave the whole machine hopelisly stuck! |
Jerry R. Nuss
Member
Username: Jerrynuss
Post Number: 24
Registered: 02-2005
Posted From: 66.20.226.3
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, April 21, 2005 - 10:17 am: |
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I hear that all the time about the Argo. Yes it has a differential type transmission, but anyone that owns one knows that it is just a matter of applying the brake slightly to the side without traction to get the other side pulling. It is not a difficult thing and almost is instinctive when driving an Argo. The arguement really doen't add up in actual use. The Argo transmission is a very good unit. There are other legitimate faults with the Argo but the transmission is not really one of them. |
Fredryck T. Macko
New member
Username: Ftmacko
Post Number: 2
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 216.45.135.54
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, April 21, 2005 - 03:29 pm: |
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Thanks for all the input. I've tried a john boat in there and really couldn't access much of the area. I just visited the go-devil site. What a hoot! It did look a little obnoxious for my purposes though. I'm afraid the Area Manager might stuff that go-devil where the Hunting Moon don't shine if I cranked that up in there and speaking of, he put me in touch with a feller that duck hunts in there with an Argo. This hunter tells me he's run a Bigfoot in there for years and has never had a problem negotiating it. I'm posting the link to the Terra-Server map of the area. Once there you can pull up the aerial map of most any location you like including where you hunt or ride. Have a good day guys.
http://terraserver.homeadvisor.msn.com/image.aspx?T=1&S=12&Z=16&X=282&Y=4505&W=3 |
Robert S.
New member
Username: Hellonsixwheels
Post Number: 4
Registered: 02-2005
Posted From: 4.233.143.17
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, April 21, 2005 - 10:49 pm: |
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fredryck,if you can test drive both brands.....do so before buying either and get the one you like the best.i have owned 2 max IV's both with the 26 inch terra tires and sold them both.one was a 96
and the other a 99,both had the 18hp vangaurd.
i had a lot of fun with both of them but i didnt like the 12" wheel 26" tire combo on them. the 9"
wheel 25" tire setup that they ran on earlier max 4's i thought rode a lot better and was a better
tire in my opinion.[rawhide III,same as an argo bigfoot]i tried to run the tires at 2psi,3 psi etc ...etc...if i ran them at anything under 5 psi
they would peel off the bead in really rough terrain. i have had a number of aatv's including
max II's,terra tigers,attex,skipper,jiger,coot,terra jet etc etc....all in all around 40+ machines over the years.i could go on all day and tell you about my experience's with them but my fingers wnt take that much typing.
the flavor of the day for me right now is a 1996
argo response that i got a really good buy on.i have always strayed away from argo because of what i read about thier differential transmission.
there is a mudbog near me that no 4 wheeler known to man could ever dream of making it through that i tried to make it through with the 99 max IV that i had on several occasions.no dice....it would go in and that was it.
this past weekend i took the argo response down to that same mudbog and mind you it has the 22 inch runamuks on it that basically have no real tread to speak of compared to the max's terra tire and this thing swam around in it like a duck in a pond!!! no problem at all......go figure?? im guessing in must have been that useless differential tranny that got me through it.{and no i wasnt doing any fancy steering,just driving
through like it was born to do it.}
at this point in time i dont know what to tell you.i bought my wife a brand new maxII 2 years ago and i really like driving that and the argo.
would i buy another max 4,definitely not.another max2,probably. argo 8 or 6 wheeler(my father in-law has a 2002 bigfoot that i have driven quite a bit)definitly.
when i get tired of fooling around with these i will be movin up to a hydrotraxx or a triton predator,hopefully within the next 2 years.
just my 2 cent worth from personal experience,not daydreaming or trying to b.s. anyone. |
roadwolf (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 64.229.201.126
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 26, 2005 - 01:01 am: |
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nuss baby, it does hold up in actual use! ya can't get outta tha slop doin' 180's, seriously. |
Jerry R. Nuss
Member
Username: Jerrynuss
Post Number: 28
Registered: 02-2005
Posted From: 66.20.226.51
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 26, 2005 - 08:40 am: |
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I don't understand what you are trying to say. Are you doing 180's to get out of "the slop"? To do a 180 I need power to one side or the other. I accomplish this by breaking to one side. If you are saying the Argo can't get through because it will only do a 180 then you make no sense.
I've seen a lot of Argos pull right through deep mud so I don't get the arguement that they don't work. I believe there are other more important factors such as tire size and tread, weight in the machine, driving ability. |
Fred Sowerwine, Montana's Max dealer
Intermediate Member
Username: Fred4dot
Post Number: 52
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 216.166.168.53
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 26, 2005 - 02:32 pm: |
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Robert S, I don't think you understand that conditions in mud holes do not stay constant. The only way to know which tire works better is to have multiple models of the same machine with different tires (different model machines with different tires will not tell you anything). Your statement that an argo response with 22" runamuck tires will outperform a Max IV with 26" tires (any engine) is just rubbish. Running 5 PSI in any Max tire is not recommended (5 PSI is the maximum one should use and only then if you are overloading your machine). If you can't keep the 26" tire mounted on a 12" k rim with 2.5 PSI (several people say they run at 1 PSI with no problems), something is wrong with your tire or your rim (make sure you only use water for lubricant when mounting the tires). The 25" tire on the old 9"rim can be a bugger to keep mounted even at 4 PSI. I do agree that the 25" tire is a much smoother riding tire and wish RI would get a 9" K rim and offer it again.
All I can say about your stated choice for the future, is that PSI on the ground does matter and if you really had trouble with a Max IV in the mud, you better make sure you wear waders and have a winch on your new machine. I will except out the Argo Avenger, but aside from the Avenger, no other skidsteer in current production can perform on an equal with a Max IV (18 HP engine or larger). |
Fredryck T. Macko
New member
Username: Ftmacko
Post Number: 3
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 216.45.135.54
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 27, 2005 - 12:03 pm: |
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Well guys, after all I've heard from both sides of the fence, it came down to the right deal. I test drove an Argo Avenger in Kosciusko and loved it but I found a 2004 MaxIV 900T with the 26" tire upgrade and the "Package A" of accys with less than 4 hours on it. I scooped this deal up on eBay for $7100. Perhaps more than I could have purchased a "project" for, but a great price for a brand new machine. I'm now looking forward to accessorizing this machine for my hunting needs. I've been scavenging pics of custom cages from the gallery. If anyone has pics of cages and accys geared to hunting that are not already posted, would ya mind sending them on. I'll post pics when I get it ready. Once again, thanks for all the good information.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1,1&item=4544642019& sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT |
Missouri's Max Dealer (Brandon Price)
Member
Username: Brandon_price
Post Number: 20
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 69.27.205.97
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 27, 2005 - 04:45 pm: |
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The best machine always wins when a person takes the time to compare them all. Looks like you have a bit a drive to get your machine, MS to OK.
A roll cage is a great idea and I haven't sold a vehicle yet that didn't get roll over protection. If you make your own, be sure to support the upper body with brackets off the seat frame. I've seen many older Max IVs tore up by people loading down the upper body with a custom cage. Over several years unsupported, the upper body will sag down and begin to rub the 26" tires. Seat belts should also be used on any ATV with a roll cage/bar.
Keep us up to date with your Maxing experiences. |
Jerry R. Nuss
Member
Username: Jerrynuss
Post Number: 29
Registered: 02-2005
Posted From: 66.20.228.193
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 27, 2005 - 05:03 pm: |
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Congratulations on your new machine. The Max IV is a very good AATV and the 26" tires are the best way to go. Being a 2004 you should get a lot of service out of it with proper maint. |
Robert S.
New member
Username: Hellonsixwheels
Post Number: 5
Registered: 02-2005
Posted From: 4.233.143.188
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 27, 2005 - 07:31 pm: |
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Fred,i have been riding atv's of all sorts for 25+ years so im pretty sure by now i understand the concept of less water=thicker mud,more water=thinner mud. what you dont understand is that this is not your "normal" mud hole.it is faily consistent as far as conditions are concerned considering it is constantly fed by an underground spring. i realize that you are a max dealer and you will praise them come hell or high water and theres nothing wrong with that.i love the machines that recreatives ind. builds but i am not going to sugar coat anything.i did enjoy the max4's that i had but my spine thought otherwise,its a rough ride any way you slice it with the 26's.i could make it through things a little more easier with my max4 than my max2 but there was nowhere the max2 with 22" rawhide 3's couldnt follow the max4.the max4 seemed to climb things a little easier than the max2.this is not rocket science,the driver is in the front and the motor/trans is in the rear in the max4 to which effect depending on the weight of the driver you could acheive almost a perfect balance of weight distribution.now the max2 you sit in the middle and the trans and motor are behind you so the majority of the weight is to the rear of the machine. how long have you been riding atv's
fred? i would have to only guess as long as you have been selling max's. as far as the most ground clearence that everyone boasts about on the max4 with 26" tires,that my freind is rubbish.
the next time you have a max 2 and a max 4 next to each other on level ground(preferably asphalt)
measure the ground clearence on both machines from the chain wells to the ground and see how much difference there really isnt.
for you to say that no other current production skidsteer can equal a max4 is utter b**ls**t and i have proven it to myself in the real world not by means of pen and paper with psi being my only means of defense.
i guess that all the swamps and mudbogs that the
old max's,terra tigers,attex's etc..etc..with the old style balloon tires with almost no tread went through was only a figment of everyones imagination because it couldnt possibly have happened in your world. |
Fredryck T. Macko
New member
Username: Ftmacko
Post Number: 4
Registered: 04-2005
Posted From: 216.45.135.54
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 27, 2005 - 09:04 pm: |
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Yea, I've got a 10 hour drive but also have a sister there that I haven't visited in a while. I haven't heard that about the upper body trim. I'll keep that in mind. I have a preliminary drawing that I'll modifiy to attach to seat frames once I have the vehicle in the garage to gander at. It combines several of the features I admired of other cages in the photo gallery including running the cross bars several inches lower than the upper side bars much like a truck rack. I have an idea about strategically placing pullies on the rack to allow me to use the winch to lift big game onto the back rack. I've already started calling buddies trying to locate that perfect source of aluminum tube and angle. I hope to have it tricked out come October 1st for the start of our bow season. As far as my choice in machine, with my limited real time experience, I was just looking to get the most machine with the least amount of problems for the least amount of money. You guys know you're making me feel like an instigator and truly, that is not my intent. Maybe years down the road after gaining experience with both machines, I may form a bias or opinion of my own. Until then, I'm gonna let that argument alone. Lol! |
Fred Sowerwine, Montana's Max dealer
Intermediate Member
Username: Fred4dot
Post Number: 53
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 216.166.168.53
Rating: 
Votes: 2 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 27, 2005 - 11:40 pm: |
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Robert, IMO, mud holes change based on traffic as much as anything - the first trip through is always the easiest. I had a spot at my old place where the cattle went through a ditch. They kept it stirred up and it was almost impassable even with a max (my buffalo never did make it through because it weighs too much). When the cattle were out of the pasture for a month or so, it firmed up enough that it wasn't a problem at all.
I don't think you have ever heard me say much about clearance because you are right, there is very little difference at the low point of the chain troughs (about 1/4 inch) between the Max II with 22" tires and the Max IV with 26" tires (the Max IV has skid plates that robs about 1/2 inch). The reason the Max IV goes better is the width of the tire and the depth of the tread. Actually, a Max IV with 21" or 22" tires is a poorer performer than a max II because it weighs more, carries more and is using the same rubber.
I started in the skid steer world in 1967 with an amphicat. I have been a max dealer since May of 1994. I never said balloon tires didn't work - I'm just saying tires with deep tread work better.
If you ran max tires at 5 PSI there is no doubt in my mind that you had a very rough ride. I think max at three PSI is too rough with only one person on board (Don't forget, I am the one who stocks and sells air pillows to soften the ride). The reason your Argo rides better is that it weighs significantly more, has all the weight in the front of the machine and uses a narrower tire. What the operator gains in comfort with an argo, he loses in performance (that balance you talk about in the Max IV (with 26" tires) is why it out performs most everything else.
Yes, I praise the performance of the max machines, but it is earned. There have been plenty of posts by Argo folks (and the other heavy weights) that back up what I say about PSI on the ground (sure there are some who won't own up to its importance, but they are only kidding themselves). You can make fun of PSI on the ground figures if you want to, but you can't change the laws of physics. Weight, balance and PSI on the ground in addition to horse power to the wheels is what makes the max the most performance minded skid steer on the market today. It doesn't matter what you, I or others say or think. The specs say it all and the performance proves the specs. |
roadwolf (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 64.229.170.163
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, April 30, 2005 - 02:25 am: |
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ok ok, go and buy a argo, but make sure you are ridin w/a friend who has a max or a 6x6 w/all wheel drive to pull you out! |
David G. Calderone
New member
Username: Kaos
Post Number: 4
Registered: 10-2005
Posted From: 209.165.187.85
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, October 05, 2005 - 03:25 pm: |
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I know this argument will go on till the end of time, but here is anothier point of view.
I have looked at both machines, and would be happy with either. My decision to obtain a Max IV over the Argo Bigfoot has to deal with two main issues:
1. The Argo Bigfoot is really a two passenger vehicle. The rear cargo area is limited to 140 pounds per Argo literature. This means that only children or samll adults can ride in the back. The Max IV is just limited to the overall load.
2. The horsepower to weight ratio is much better in the Max IV with any engine 18 HP and above.
Please note that I choose the 6x6 Argos to compare to the Max IV, because they are similar in overall dimensions and cost. I would be the first to tell you; if you need a lot of room for people and cargo go with the Argo 8x8. |
stanley c onwuha (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 81.199.42.16
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 20, 2006 - 04:26 am: |
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I wish to congratulate you on your amphibious Buffalo.its really a wonderful innovation for multiple purposes. |
Bob Shelver
Member
Username: Curly
Post Number: 34
Registered: 01-2006
Posted From: 209.193.87.58
Rating:
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 20, 2006 - 10:44 am: |
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I congratulate you Fred on the dedication to your product and obviously you have been in it for quite some time and are very knowledgeable. I have been in it since 1994 and looked into both the MAX and the ARGO before taking on the product and much like you I am very satisfied with my choice I made. Because we are somewhat close to each other I welcome the opportunity to meet you and do the challenge. While most Max vehicles are sold with a heavy cross bar tread and ARGOs are sold with the standard Runamuk tire defiantly presents different match up on grip of the ground. I will give you the 3 wheel 6 wheel drive thing I here about, while sometimes it possess a challenge but with a little driving adjustment it has never stopped any of us. While PSI on the ground is important it is not the whole game. I would take a Bigfoot and a 6x6 Conquest setup properly and match it pound for pound overall performance against any and all AATV comers. Whatever areas I lost in I would bring out the Avenger and GAME-SET-and MATCH. I spent the first 5 years in business defending my ARGO product against other AATV machines. It is my position to encourage all potential buyers to drive all AATV machines before they purchase one, talk to as many people as you can, match your application to the information you have gathered then go for it, the my truck is better then your truck thing will never go away. When I started to be a user on the page I said to myself I would never flaunt my product but I just could not let this one go. Sorry for the boast! |
philip w.cox
Advanced Member
Username: Philipatmaxfour
Post Number: 119
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 216.209.144.8
Rating:
Votes: 2 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 20, 2006 - 07:23 pm: |
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HI Bob Shelver-Are you saying that you have seen an Argo product like a Bigfoot or Avenger that will keep up with a MAX IV with 26 inch tires in the water? W. Philip Cox |
Jerry R. Nuss, Max Dealer in Illinois
Senior Member
Username: Jerrynuss
Post Number: 272
Registered: 02-2005
Posted From: 71.244.175.65
Rating:
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, February 21, 2006 - 08:35 am: |
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I don't see the point in addressing a post from 10 months ago. The arguement about which machine is best won't ever go anywhere. The challenge between the different brands of machines happens all the time on group rides. Different machines often excel where others fail, then ten minutes later the roles are reversed. The difference may have much more to do with the operator's skill level. Fred is a true believer and is a very valuable resource to this board, just as Bob is. Pulling out an Avenger to compete against a Max is real close to being an apples versus oranges competition. What is the real similiarity besides being amphibious? Having owned an Argo and a Max I feel much safer in a Max on difficult rough terrain. When climbing up a steep hill I can actually see where I am going in a Max. When crossing a large diameter tree or rock I don't get the slingshot effect of being catapulted in an Argo because of the rearward seating position. When going down hill in a Max I can use the brakes and descend in a cofortable controlled manner. After having an Argo endo twice when going down a steep hill because I pulled back just a bit to hard or bounced a little and locked up the brakes and ended upside down trapped uder a machine with hot oil pouring on top of me I sort of lost my love for the Argo. Most likely I was going down a hill beyond the recommended angle by the manufacturer so I was using it in an improper manner for which it was not designed. Then there is the problem I used to frequently face until I got a Max with climbing out of the water. There are many places where I couldn't get an Argo to climb out of the water because the front tires could not get up on something to pull itself out of the water. The Max at the same exit points drove out like it was notihing. These comparisons have all been made using a 6x6 vs a 6x6 and with me doing the driving. With someone else the results may be much different. Then when we get into Brandon selling both brands of machines...that is just smart business sense and I credit him for promoting the amphibious atv as well as he does, and for giving the customer an option. When I show a customer a Max and take a test ride I tell them about Argo and how to get in touch with a local dealer or two. After they describe why they want the machine it is better to assess their situation and get them into a machine they will be happy with and enjoy instead of letting it sit or selling it on Ebay with low hours. I think this is what Bob was getting to in the heart of his post. Make the customer or owner happy and satisfied with the machine they choose and they will promote the amphibious atv. Everyone on this discussion forum has seen the benefit of the amphibious machine so instead of publicly trashing the other, promoting the machine and being honest about the strengths and weaknesses is the better way to go. To add and not sound like I am negative about Argo, my Argo experience did include some great service from Becky Orr and from Fred Sain. The Argo is much easier to set up an outboard on. The Argo is much easier to drive on level or gentle terrain and spin circles. And without it I would not have gotten into Max. Meaning no amphibious experiences or enjoyment besides my first childhood experiences in an Attex.
Both brands have their benefits and weaknesses. |
Derek Hubbard
Member
Username: Justmax
Post Number: 20
Registered: 02-2005
Posted From: 71.64.127.199
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, February 21, 2006 - 09:55 pm: |
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Argo vs Max should not be the question asked. It should be six wheelers (and eight wheelers too!!) vs quads. With China flooding the market with cheap quads now, that is the new problem for the few remaining AATV makers left. Who cares if it is an Argo or a Max ,they will both get you across that mud hole somewhat dry and clean. Please remember the AATV club is not cheap to get into (unless you find a nice used one for a great price)....Cheap China quads are selling for less than $2,000 at Pep Boys and other discount auto parts shops.
I own a MAx II and an Amphicat, but test drove an Argo Avenger. The Avenger is a lovely AATV for those who need it or can afford it. I am with Jerry on this one ,both machines have their good points. Fight the quads not each other |
Tory Gardner (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 69.72.81.118
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 22, 2006 - 12:05 pm: |
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The differance between Max and Argo????? That like explaining to somebody the differance between a Flat Fender Willy's Jeep and a new Hummer. I mean the Willy's is tuff as nails and helped win WW2 but the Hummer comes with cup holders and endless colors and options. I personally own two customized Max 2's with full roll cages and I made my own options but that dosent mean I wouldnt own an Argo. I'm waiting for Argo to come out with their 6x6 Avenger!!!! I rode in their prototype R&D machine at Copper Ridge and I really like the looks of it. I cant say it was any more capable than a Big Foot but they did have a 23HP Briggs in it. |
Missouri's Max and Argo Dealer
Intermediate Member
Username: Brandon_price
Post Number: 96
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 69.27.205.75
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 22, 2006 - 01:55 pm: |
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I hope they use something other than a Briggs in the Avenger 6x6. The 23hp Kohler air cooled would be a much better option. Kohlers perform so much better for an ATV application. If they price the vehicle right it will sell good. The current Conquest 6x6 is priced so high that it is just unreasonable. The Response 8x8 is actually slightly less money!
EFI is coming. |
philip w.cox
Advanced Member
Username: Philipatmaxfour
Post Number: 120
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 64.228.3.3
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 22, 2006 - 10:22 pm: |
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Brandon, can you give us a couple of advantages of having an efi engine in an aatv? My first thought is- maybe I wouldn't need a choke cable. Is efi better on steep slopes? W. Philip Cox |
david berger
Senior Member
Username: Davidrrrd
Post Number: 280
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 172.139.38.70
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, February 23, 2006 - 08:43 am: |
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philip i can name a few,
first they start instantly,
in any type wether from sea shore too the highest peaks they run trouble free, unlike carbed engines,
some work great at home at x feet above sea level,
then you trailer em to some event 500 miles away and your at a diferent elevation, and maybe even the air preshures afected by the wether that day too!
and it fails to run as it did at home. this may have contributed to some of my troubles on some event weekends.
the computer controled fuel injected engines alwase at the best air/fuel mix! |
Missouri's Max and Argo Dealer
Intermediate Member
Username: Brandon_price
Post Number: 97
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 69.27.205.27
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, February 23, 2006 - 03:26 pm: |
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Most of the big quads are already going to EFI. I can't believe it has taken this long to make the switch for ATVs. David has covered some of the many benefits. Quick, easy starts with no choke cable is the first thing. EFI provides perfect throttle response. That will take care of the hesitation problem our Briggs engines suffer from (the other brands aren't perfect either). EFI also uses a real fuel pump instead of the little vacuum pump. That means no more choking out on steep hills from fuel starvation. EFI will increase the perfomance of our Max and Argos even more. I can't wait to get the first EFI amphib. |
Bob Shelver
Member
Username: Curly
Post Number: 37
Registered: 01-2006
Posted From: 209.193.87.93
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, February 26, 2006 - 11:34 am: |
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There are many people that don't like the Briggs engine because they have trouble with carb hesitation. It is true that it is not a true variable speed carburetor and throttle system, but I have to do a lot of fine tuning at my altitude 6000+ which I am sure is more of a challenge then at 1000 ft and lower. Three things pilot jet, air fuel screw adjustment and spark plugs and you may even at low elevations need to change the main jet. The hesitation is a lean mix symptom at first acceleration. Move to a hotter spark plug, richen the air fuel mix screw, (take the plastic stop off the needle screw so you can move it more then a 1/4 turn). If you still have a bad hesitation get with a Briggs guy and get a larger pilot jet then re-adjust air fuel mix screw. You want the hotter plug because you will be idling richer and the hotter plug will help clean it up. Get a good spark Plug NGK or Bosh even Autolite, throw the Champs in the trash! You can also take the top off the breather and remove the foam pre-filter get some good fresh air in to the engine. It is not a fix all but it works in the high country. The EFI will be a good addition but just like our Auto industry when the computer age hit it, a lot of home maintenance went out the window and went to the local garage and cost $75.00 to $100.00 bucks an hour. Be careful for what you wish for! |
liflod
Intermediate Member
Username: Liflod
Post Number: 70
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 67.165.55.22
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, February 26, 2006 - 12:08 pm: |
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Thanks for the info Bob. It is nice to hear someone with a good game plan for fixing the problems instead of just complaining about them.
I just recently sat down to read the Briggs manual and it suggested turning the idle jet richer to reduce the hesitation. I have not tried it yet, but with this new found knowledge, I'll start tweaking the next time I ride.
How do I figure out which spark plugs to use. I know the information is out there, but what do you recommend as a starting point ? |
Bob Shelver
Member
Username: Curly
Post Number: 38
Registered: 01-2006
Posted From: 209.193.87.93
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, February 26, 2006 - 12:54 pm: |
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It depends what year engine you have the newer engines have a different plug but ,the Autolite 3926 or the Bosch fr8dpx or the NGK equel not sure off the top of my head the NGK number, but when you go to the parts store they can cross and get the next hotter in the brand you want. I pull Champs out all the time they just don't fire even and give you a good fuel burn. These engines were designed to run at a fixed RPM so they are jetted some what rich. In an ATV application when you are running the throttle up and down you can jet it a bit different. You just have to learn to read your spark plugs to make sure you don't run too lean and burn the piston. Don't pull the plugs out while hot wait until it cools a bit. A white electrode too lean a black too rich, golden brown just right, and look for an even burn around the electrode not black on one side and brown on the other. |
Vaughn hurdsman (Unregistered Guest)
Unregistered guest
Posted From: 64.70.24.54
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, February 26, 2006 - 07:10 pm: |
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Speaking of spark plugs. The small engine guy that I go to recomends Denso spark plugs to all of the plug manufactures. He also says the same as Bob Shelver on the champion plugs throw them in the trash. I run he denso Iridium plugs in my max with great results. They are very expensive though. |
Bob Shelver
Member
Username: Curly
Post Number: 39
Registered: 01-2006
Posted From: 209.193.88.242
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 27, 2006 - 09:55 am: |
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I have not run them myself but I may try some next time. Thanks |
My Favorite Machine: Talk about you favorite ATV and Why.