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rgo8X8
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:26 pm: | 
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Hello All. I have enjoyed reading the discussions on this board for awhile now and would now like to start a discussion on track options for an Argo Response.
I have a 2001 Argo Response which I am really happy with and I would like to play in the snow with it this year. I am considering getting a set of Tru trax for this machine but would like to hear some real world experiences of those who have used tru trax verses the std argo tracks or argo supertracks in the same snow conditons.
I live in Idaho.
Thanks in advance for any advice on trutrax vs ODG tracks. |
Douglas MacCullagh (Dougmac)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:26 pm: |
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rgo8X8, I also have a Response. A retired Marine I work with told me that with tracks, wider is better - always. I was thinking about tracks for mud here in Mississippi, but I haven't bought tracks yet. However, standard Argo tracks seem mighty narrow to me. |
David Keeso (Argomag)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:26 pm: |
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We have had a set of standard tracks for over 16 years now, used every year except last ( They were only on for one run) and they have been smashed, crashed, stuck, skidded on, and tortured, and they have not failed yet. They were from the origional ARGO my dad had, way before I was born. Then he got a new one, and used the tracks on it. Then he bought our Magnum, and we use the tracks on it. They stand up well and can smash the living hell out of them. |
rgo8X8
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:26 pm: |
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Doug, Thanks for the advice. I had an Argo 6X6 and put a set of Argo supertracks on it, but they were so wide that they took a lot of power to run. However, the floatation was excellent.
I now have the Response and think that the added length should make up for some width without taking extra power. I did some theoretical calculations on an Argo Vanguard, an Argo Response, and a Max IV with TruTrax, Argo Std tracks and Argo Supertracks. I used the specs from the manufacturers and added 6" to the wheelbase (to assume some sinkage into the snow) and came up with the following calculations:
Trutrax ArgoStd ArgoSuper
Argo Vanguard 1.06 1.02 0.74
Argo Response 0.98 0.94 0.68
Max IV 0.97 0.93 0.67
The numbers are ground pressure in Pounds/Square inch.
I don't know if you can mount Argo tracks on a Max, but I thought it was interesting to throw it in the comparison, if only theoretically. I also could not find the actual width of the Max tracks to make a comparison to a real Max product.
From this you can see that the Argo Super Tracks have the least ground pressure. I don't like them because they require me to install hubs to push out the wheels and they really take a lot of power to push through the snow. I think that they add a lot of stress on the bearings/axles/brakes due to their width and the wheel hubs. On top of that, they are very spendy. The Tru trax are quite reasonably priced.
I would still like to hear from someone who has run both Argo super tracks and TruTrax on an Argo 8X8 in the same snow to hear some real world comparisons.
Neil - |
Timothy Schotanus (Mudbuster)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:26 pm: |
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I have the factory rubber max track. It is 15 inch wide. However, no snow last year means that I have no real life experiance with them in the snow. I am waiting patiently for the first big storm. |
John Kevin Maiolo (Johnmaiolo)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:26 pm: |
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I heard a topic raised in regards to the MARSHMASTER made in Baton Rouge Louisiana. I submitted 5 jpegs to Richard on Thursday night of this machine that we have at my workplace. Look for them in the photo gallery. Richard will post them as time permits. |
rgo8X8
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:26 pm: |
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AATVers,
I got the TruTrax installed on my Response and today we finally got our first snow of the year. We got around 6" of wet snow and the tracks worked great! I got the optional ice cleat kit which puts a lot of metal down into the ice and I found that they worked very well. The only problem that I had with them today is that they tended to plug up with the wet sticky snow.
After crusing around for a couple of hours I put the snow plow on and found that the machine was greatly improved as a snow plow platform with the addition of the TruTrax. With the tracks on the machine is more stable and doesn't want to be pushed sideways by a plow full of snow nearly as much as the machine alone. I also found the ice cleats to be far superior to Argo's factory ice cleats for plowing. The Argo cleats just attach to the edge of the track, but the tru trax cleats run right under the tires and are much wider, about 6" per cleat. There are 2 cleats per track section on the Tru Trax. With the TruTrax on I was able to plow very steep sections going uphill! I have never plowed uphill in the past, only downhill.
All in all, I am very happy with the TruTrax so far in my application. They were very reasonably priced (compared to Argo or Max factory tracks) they appear to be very high quality, and they have enough floatation for how I intend to use the machine, in the snow we have here. The TruTrax Ice cleat system is also the best cleat system for snowplowing. They come with Stainless steel pins which are a higher quality than the Argo track pins.
If anyone wants to check out the TruTrax on a response just surf on over to http://photos.yahoo.com/nneiwert and then go the photo album titled "Argo with Tracks" |
Rem721
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:26 pm: |
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rgo8X8 - the Response looks great with the TruTrax on. Thanks for sharing the photos. Please keep us informed on how the TruTRax work out in various conditions and uses. Any slapping or rubbing on the tub that you noticed? How reasonable were the TruTrax priced? |
rgo8X8
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:26 pm: |
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Rem721, Glad you enjoyed the pics. I will put up another post when I have had a chance to run the machine in some deep snow. Hopefully mother nature will soon provide such an opportunity.
I was worried that the tracks might slap the tub. I can pull them up to the tub if I want to. The metal cleats also decrease the clearance. In the end though, this was not a problem. The only problem I had was the sticky snow building up around the cleats, then the snow would rub on the tub. This was solved by a few minutes of scraping.
I will inspect the machine carefully next time I have it out for any contact, but I did not hear any.
For pricing you can check out http://www.trutrax.com/ and get an exact quote for your machine. |
Fred Sowerwine, Montana's Max Dealer (Fred4dot)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:26 pm: |
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rgo8X8, Try spraying some cooking "Pam" on your metal parts to keep the snow from sticking. That advice was given to me several years ago on this board to keep the snow from sticking to my snow plow blade. Works pretty well. |
liflod (Liflod)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:26 pm: |
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I have also heard that truckers use bleach poured on the tires to keep the snow from sticking to the rubber. |
Bruce
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:26 pm: |
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Fuel oil will keep snow from sticking to a plow. |
Phil Millam
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:26 pm: |
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Hi, have a Max IV which is use only in winter on rubber tracks. It works well most of the time, but someone suggested that I look into adding snowmobile lugs onto the outside edge of the track. Not sure what a snowmobile lug is. Any experience or ideas out there? Live in North Central Washington in snow country. |
newmax
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:26 pm: |
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i bought some snowmobile spike studs they are star shaped stude that bolt on i am just aboutfinished putting them on and will try them today and let you know how they work. |
david berger (Davidrrrd)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:26 pm: |
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hi phil m, the lugs can be of severl typs,they can be screws with raisd edges on heads that you screw into track, (not too agesave)
there are real tall spike thingys witch are like bolts with real wide heads n nuts wide as washers that hold the bolt outward twards the snow, some may even look like pop rivets on steroids,
you can find them on page 50 of the free catelog from www.AlsSnowmobile.com or # 802-487-1000
they are in newport,vermont. |
david berger (Davidrrrd)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:26 pm: |
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hi phil m, the lugs can be of severl typs,they can be screws with raisd edges on heads that you screw into track, (not too agesave)
there are real tall spike thingys witch are like bolts with real wide heads n nuts wide as washers that hold the bolt outward twards the snow, some may even look like pop rivets on steroids,
you can find them on page 50 of the free catelog from www.AlsSnowmobile.com or # 802-487-1000
they are in newport,vermont. |
Brian
New member
Username: Brianprovo
Post Number: 1
Registered: 11-2005
Posted From: 24.2.91.219
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, November 02, 2005 - 11:10 pm: |
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TO rgo8X8
I recently purchased a 2002 Conquest and am now looking for a set of tracks for it. I've been reading past posts and came across yours from February when you got your TRU TRAX. I am interested in how you still like them or any other information you or anyone else has on purchasing a set of tracks. Used is fine with me. Thanks in advance for any advice and help in helping make up my mind. I have a cabin in the Utah mountains that I'll be going to, generally fairly deep powder to go through. My wife hates the snowmobiles so have sold them and just got the Argo! |
Dan Taylor
New member
Username: Dt5428
Post Number: 5
Registered: 02-2005
Posted From: 69.14.169.110
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, November 03, 2005 - 12:38 am: |
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Buy the super tracks you won't be sorry. You also might consider adding a dial a jet we have one on our conquest and also have the super tracks. Don't waste your money on the regular tracks.
Later,Dan |
Brian
New member
Username: Brianprovo
Post Number: 2
Registered: 11-2005
Posted From: 24.2.91.219
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, November 03, 2005 - 10:14 am: |
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Dan, you'll have to tell me what a "dial a jet" is. Haven't heard of it. I'm leaning towards the super tracks but they are pricey. |
Dan Taylor
New member
Username: Dt5428
Post Number: 6
Registered: 02-2005
Posted From: 69.14.169.110
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, November 03, 2005 - 10:59 am: |
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Here is the link to Thunder products.
http://www.thunderproducts.com/dial_a_jet.htm
I would explain but it is much better to read from the website. We use the dial a jet on our Conquest and 4 wheelers.
Later,Dan |
Brian
New member
Username: Brianprovo
Post Number: 3
Registered: 11-2005
Posted From: 24.2.91.219
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, November 03, 2005 - 02:46 pm: |
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Dan, thanks for the info on the dial a jet, I've book marked the page for future reference. Right now I'm in the "get a set of tracks" mode. If I'm going to use the Argo for what I purchased it for (getting up to our cabin) I need those first. More power = Always good! |
Brian
New member
Username: Brianprovo
Post Number: 4
Registered: 11-2005
Posted From: 24.2.91.219
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, November 05, 2005 - 10:53 am: |
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I'm still hoping for more comments on the different types of tracks to help me make an informed decision in making a purchase. As I previously stated I recently purchased a '02 Conquest which I want to use to take my family up to our cabin in the Utah mountains. I had read posts from last years from "rgo8x8" about his purchase of TRU TRAX and wondered if he was still pleased with them, how they did on deep powder etc... Thanks for your responses!!!! |
Fred Sowerwine, Montana's Max dealer
Intermediate Member
Username: Fred4dot
Post Number: 95
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 216.166.168.53
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, November 05, 2005 - 01:09 pm: |
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Brian, There are lots of comments here on Route6x6 in other discussions about tracks, PSI on the ground, condition of snow, water content of snow, etc.
Performance of a tracked machine will depend entirely on the type of snow you are using it in. If the snow has a high water content, the narrow tracks might work OK. If the snow is dry and fluffy, even the wide tracks will have a hard time unless your actual PSI on the ground is less than 1 (maybe in the 0.65 to 0.85 range).
The solid rubber tracks will provide you with better flotation than the tracks with cracks and holes because the entire surface will provide support (again this is more apparent in dry fluffy snow).
You don't state the elevation of the area where you will be using you machine or the temperatures you plan on encountering. I will advise that if you have dry fluffy powder (here in Montana, we call it "cold smoke" and it can be so light and fluffy that in depths over two feet you can walk in it as if it were dry ground) that you should buy the 20" wide solid rubber tracks made by that fellow in Canada. I don't think you will be happy with anything less, especially if you will be hauling a load. The Max machines use a 15" wide solid belt and they weigh significantly less than other makes (lower PSI on the ground) and there are times when a machine carrying a full load cannot get there (I try to be by myself with as small a cargo as possible when I am going in tough conditions).
My guess is that rgo8x8 found out that the tru trax didn't work very well in the dry snow and didn't want to admit it after the discussions we had about how well they would work. |
Brian
New member
Username: Brianprovo
Post Number: 5
Registered: 11-2005
Posted From: 24.2.91.219
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, November 05, 2005 - 01:51 pm: |
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Fred, our cabin is at about 7800 feet. Snow conditions vary but after a snow storm there will often be a good couple of feet of powder. I sure liked the price of the Tru Trax but it looks like more and more through comments like yours that I keep hearing that I'll want to go with the Argo Super Tracks. You mentioned 20" tracks from Canada. Do you have any further info on them, I don't think I've heard of this option yet. |
Jack Ouellette
New member
Username: Beungood
Post Number: 1
Registered: 02-2005
Posted From: 152.163.100.203
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, November 05, 2005 - 05:15 pm: |
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The fellow in Canada you mention ,would he be RS Bolduc? Here is a linc to his website.
Tout-Terrains R.S. Bolduc exclusive RSB rubber tracks, 20 inches width, joint free, are manufactured by Soucy International in Drummundville. High performance, providing more floatation and more security than other models, no need of steel ice cleats. No ice or snow accumulation in the track. They reduce vibration so your driving becomes easier in mountain or snow-covered fields.
These tracks are available for all ARGO 8 X 8 (Magnum- Response-Conquest). They fit on Goodyear Runamuk tires (22"), fixed with Spacers . For 6 X 6 models (Big Foot), these tracks can be adapted to your vehicle. Also available, 20" wide RSB tracks with metal guides, fixed with Spacers to go over Argo Avenger Goodyear Rawhide III (25") tires
http://www.argorsbolduc.com/items.html |
Fred Sowerwine, Montana's Max dealer
Intermediate Member
Username: Fred4dot
Post Number: 96
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 216.166.168.53
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, November 05, 2005 - 07:07 pm: |
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Yes, Sir, Jack, That is the gentleman and the track I am talking about. Thanks for chiming in. I was going to try to find the posts where we talked about the wide tracks, but hadn't got to it yet. The only problem with a wide track is the power it takes to run with it and the extra stress put on the drive system.
Brian, at 7800 feet elevation you are going to loose 5 or more horsepower. I think you should look into the dial a jet before you get the tracks. rgo8x8 said his six wheeled machine could barely handle the argo super track and the 20" wide one will take more power yet. Anything operating over 2500 or 3000 feet, isn't going to perform near as well as it does at sea level where all the testing and rating is done. |
Anonymous
Posted From: 72.138.89.77
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, November 11, 2005 - 10:48 pm: |
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I just got my new tracks from Rejean at RS Bolduc. They look to be of very high quality. No snow to try them out yet. Something to consider as well is the rubber tracks do weigh significantly more than the standard track (I think they are around 100lbs each), but the extra flotation and grip will make them the better performer. Rejean has them in stock and is able to ship them quick! |
Jesse Duke
New member
Username: Yukoner
Post Number: 3
Registered: 10-2005
Posted From: 207.189.238.76
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, October 15, 2006 - 09:43 am: |
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How does an Argo handle with rubber tracks on without snow? Is it harder to steer? I have a set of rubber tracks I am about ready to install on an Avenger, and trying to decide whether to cut the tracks and install the quick-link kit (which weakens the tracks), or just put them on permanently, which is a bit of work. I mostly want it for off-road use where I want to minimize damage (in quite remote locations), but occassionally will want to take it down bush roads. The thought of cutting the tracks given the cost is causing me to lose sleep.
Any advice or experience on this out there? |
philip w.cox
Advanced Member
Username: Philipatmaxfour
Post Number: 225
Registered: 01-2005
Posted From: 64.228.3.119
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, October 16, 2006 - 10:16 pm: |
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Jesse there is a guy on this site who asked a lot of questions before he bought tracks for his Avenger. I think maybe he originally owned a Bigfoot. His name is Tom Phillips and maybe he can tell us if he cut his tracks to install them.Any advice Tom? |
Shop Talk: Tech Tips and Q&A section