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Ron Hutt
Member
Username: Ron
Post Number: 48
Registered: 12-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 21, 2007 - 06:54 pm: | 
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Hi All
Well the tracks are on. I planned on two hours with help from one person and it turned into a all day project. Does anyone really go thru the complete instructions to the detail to put their tracks(rubber)on? The tire sizing wasn't too difficult 1.5 hours, but the tread reversal is a total pain in the butt for four tires 3.5 hours. The nuts that hold the tracks together were all loose so that took 30 minutes to tighten 300 nuts. The track installation took 1 hour even with all tires deflated. Then the new air pressure. Being my first time with the rubber tracks probably cost me an hour.
I did install two stock argo mud flaps easily and they work really well.
I just have 15 hours on the machine and am about ready to do the first fluid changes. The Tranny oil looks easy but the engine oil plug and filter looks like Kohler or Argo may have a designer that needs to go back to school or try an oil change himself first. Any easy way to get the oil out and the filter changed without dropping it all inside the machine?
Ron |
Rogersmith
Advanced Member
Username: Rogersmith
Post Number: 348
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 21, 2007 - 08:48 pm: |
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"I planned on two hours with help from one person and it turned into a all day project"
Sounds like me when I go out to do a "once over" before a weekend ride.
Can't help you on the tracks, but commend you for the effort to do it right. Did you swap tires side to side for the tread reversal? I would think that the rolling diameter front and rear would be important with a tight rubber belt. I know with plastic tracks, people have taken off multiple drive chains to reduce drag. |
Brad Morcom
Member
Username: Evil1
Post Number: 20
Registered: 02-2007
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 21, 2007 - 10:27 pm: |
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I have put my rubber tracks on my Avenger twice now. Yes I did follow the instructions carefully as to the tire sizes, rotation and all pf the torque specs. I have not run into ANY troubles at all running the tracks so the instructions must be well founded. I have air tools (Thank God). If you did it without airtools I feel real, real, real bad for you. As for the oil change......Hah engineers?..?..? I cant believe somone set something up this way. The filter is a blast to get at. You have to feel for the drain plug. I used a 1 gallon ziplock bag to catch the oil, I read it on this web site somewhere. It worked pretty good. There is no way you could use any type of catch pan, no room at all. But...............Playing in the snow is priceless and your urge to kick every engineer right in the N*#+ will dwindle quickly while you play. |
Dennis F. Saskowski
Advanced Member
Username: Sasko
Post Number: 148
Registered: 07-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, December 22, 2007 - 09:22 pm: |
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Guys this might help, I run rubber tracks on my max 4 and feel your pain rolloing them on the tires. Yeah it takes 2. Try this ,take a racheting web and put around the O.D. of tire on the front and rear tires compressing them as much as you can,this reduces the O.D. a little bit |
Ron Hutt
Member
Username: Ron
Post Number: 49
Registered: 12-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, December 23, 2007 - 10:28 am: |
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I have a late season Elk hunt here in Idaho on 1500 acres of private property. We finally received lots of snow. Before the tracks went onto the Argo I took my 4-wheeler up on the hill and could not make it near the top. Same story with everyone else. I went to the hill yesterday in the Argo with more snow on the hill, took the toughest route where the snow had drifted and reached the summit with all the gear and my brother. Only thing we saw was fresh animal tracks and one snowmobile track. No 4-wheelers! I have to say that the machine would not quit. I was gone for 7 hours with 5 hours on the meter and used 2/3 of tank of fuel.
While we stayed warm with the windshield up the engine water temp. never got much off the bottom of the peg. I have seen lots of posting to this problem but will the low water temp. hurt the machine if run continuously?
Now onto the easy oil and filter change.
Have a Merry Christmas and gooooood New Year.
Ron |
Jesse Duke
New member
Username: Yukoner
Post Number: 6
Registered: 10-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, December 24, 2007 - 09:20 am: |
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I put rubber tracks on my Avenger last spring, and just left them on. When through a lot of rocks this summer, cant find even a small nick in them. Seems to handle mostly the same.
Why take them off? |
Chris Chwaz
Member
Username: Buffalomax
Post Number: 25
Registered: 03-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 28, 2007 - 07:34 am: |
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Hey Ron how deep was the snow,I got plastic tracks and cant go into too deep of fresh snow at one time.How do the rubber ones work? |
Argohunter
Intermediate Member
Username: Argohunter
Post Number: 83
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, December 28, 2007 - 02:04 pm: |
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I ran across this write up about tracks on the Argo. The author had experience with the plastic tracks on pre Avenger models and then with the Avenger and the rubber tracks. Here is the site:
www.theoutdoorquest.com/PDF/Argo Avenger tracks sm.pdf |
Brian in FABULOUS Utah
Member
Username: Brianprovo
Post Number: 42
Registered: 11-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, January 01, 2008 - 03:14 pm: |
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We were up at our cabin for the past five days and had between four and five feet of snow depending on the altitude we were at: more snow at the higher altitudes. Our cabin is at about 7500 ft. I have a 2003 Conquest with Super Tracks. Due to getting around late we traveled up at night, no problems. Saturday the sun was out and I had promised to take some rather robust people (three of them & a dog) up to thier cabin. But my tracks kept slipping and we couldn't get up some of the hills. Had to use the winch three times to get out and several other times was close to having too. This is the first time I ever felt I was going to get stuck. What is the answer for this? The Argo Ice Cleats or something else. The other problem I am having is the engine lugging down when going up hill, especially when I have other people in. Often it seems there's barely enough power to move and we move at slower than a walk. Is the answer to this rejetting the engine? I know thats been discussed here. I've read some of the reviews on the dial a jet that has been talked about here and there seems to be mixed reviews on it. There was a guy with a Rhino with racks on it and he was going faster and with fewer problems that I was. In talking with him I don't think he ever did get stuck. It was a bit infururating. We did have a great time, took the kids and another family sledding, drove around and saw the mountains. Love the Argo but would like to get some of these things worked out. |
Ron Hutt
Intermediate Member
Username: Ron
Post Number: 51
Registered: 12-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, January 01, 2008 - 07:29 pm: |
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Chris
Sorry for the delay in getting back to you but the family headed North for the holidays. To answer your question about the difference between the plastic and rubber tracks. I owned a Conquest(a dog from lack of maintenace from the previous owner) with the Plastic tracks and could not get it to go anywhere in snow over a foot and a half. I took the Argo Avenger with rubber tracks and the low speed tranny with 2 other people to the summit of a local hunting area and had very little difficulty in getting on top of two and a half feet of snow climbing a 30 degrre slope with drifts (3 feet) most of the way. This time up we managed to harvest two Elk. We drug the Elk 5 miles back thru the snow behind the machine (down hill)with no effort from the Argo. I have to say the only issue I have is the the Kohler does not get past the 100 degree peg.
Hey Brian
We passed every 4-wheeler stuck trying to get up the hill and the only other machines on the mountain were Snow machines. I know the frustration sometimes trying to climb while trying to brake the machine. I think it is then that the 8-wheel drive becomes a four wheel drive pulling to one side. It caused some frustration but the fact that the machine did not want to quit was impressive.
Of course the biggest influence I think is the type of snow. Does this help? Have you checked the obvious things like tire pressures, ect.
Brian if you are at 7500 feet you really should jet the machine if the original is on it. Mine is jetted for the 3500 foot to 7500 altitude?
Ron |
Rogersmith
Advanced Member
Username: Rogersmith
Post Number: 349
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, January 02, 2008 - 11:41 am: |
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Brian, have you been the same place/conditions before w/o problems? or was this trip different. It sounds like the first time you couldn't climb what you expected to.
Besides overall engine tune and jetting, you can look at the clutches. The front has lead weights in phenolic/plactic holders that can come apart. Mine did and the engine speed was less than normal esp at low vehicle speed. The rear clutch/converter has an indexable spring with about 7 settings that determines how fast the cvt "gears up". What's the 2 letter code stamped on top of the trans?
The plastic tracks have their limit in climbing, don't know what mods there are that help. |
Brian in FABULOUS Utah
Member
Username: Brianprovo
Post Number: 43
Registered: 11-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 11:24 am: |
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Ron & Roger, thanks for your replys. As Roger asked I went out and looked at the transmission and the code stamped on it is GU. Now on the shroud surrounding the drive belt someone has written with a marker 106 JET. I don't know what either of these mean. On the day I was getting stuck the sun was out and I know that made the slow slick but still the frustrastion was there. Having this big fancy machine, not being able to get where I wanted, and seeing, what I believe to be inferior machines (Rhinos) go where I could not. I check the tire presure each time before I go out so they are all ok. The tires were not spinning within the tracks but the tracks were, on occasion, spinning. The area I travel I travel often and, in fact, had traveled the previous day-but with less weight in the machine. We're supposed to get a couple more feet of snow in the mountains this weekend. |
Rogersmith
Advanced Member
Username: Rogersmith
Post Number: 351
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 12:19 pm: |
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The G is the lowest geared trans so that is a plus for tracks at alitude. I'm not a conquest guy so can't tell you what the jet # means. I don't think the argo ice cleats will make any difference in snow.
From the armchair, I'd be thinking about engine tune, clutches, and resistance from tracks and tires. Just guessing.. |
Dennis F. Saskowski
Advanced Member
Username: Sasko
Post Number: 154
Registered: 07-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 12:58 pm: |
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Brian, after you finish checking out your machine per the posts and things are right,just remember a lot has to do with the texture of the snow. Go on the other side of the ridge/mountain same day same temp and the texture might be different. Even shaded areas in the woods have different textures than the sunny spots(like I never sunk in those spots).Deep frozen granular seems to be the worst.it's a great day if you can make snowball. |
Jerry Nuss - Illinois MAX dealer
Senior Member
Username: Jerrynuss
Post Number: 599
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 01:10 pm: |
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Is your belt getting wet from snow blowing in? Moving that slow sounds like it could be a belt slipping. Did the Rhino have the equal amount of weight as you did? |
Brian in FABULOUS Utah
Member
Username: Brianprovo
Post Number: 44
Registered: 11-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 02:01 pm: |
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More to think about. Roger what did you mean by "resistance from tracks and tires".
I know the type of snow makes a big difference and it was slick that day but lesser machines were doing better than me. Now the tracks on the Rhino were narrower than mine but they were rubber with paddle like grooves on them. Thats why I was wondering about cleats or some such thing being added to the Supertracks, if that would make a difference.
I don't think the drive belt was slipping. Didn't have any indication it was. The engine would just lug down so much going up hill that I could get out and have walked it faster even with the snow up to my crotch. |
Brian in FABULOUS Utah
Member
Username: Brianprovo
Post Number: 45
Registered: 11-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 02:03 pm: |
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....and the Rhino had two people in the front seats, and the back bed was loaded high with stuff. |
Ron Hutt
Intermediate Member
Username: Ron
Post Number: 52
Registered: 12-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 03:45 pm: |
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Hi Brian
I had the same problem with my Conquest. However there was not a four wheeler that could go with it at any time. Send me your e-mail address I have a phone number for you.
Ron |
Jerry Nuss - Illinois MAX dealer
Senior Member
Username: Jerrynuss
Post Number: 600
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 05:19 pm: |
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Well if it is not a traction problem or belt or clutch problems then it looks like engine tuning like Roger wrote. |
Jerry Nuss - Illinois MAX dealer
Senior Member
Username: Jerrynuss
Post Number: 601
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 05:26 pm: |
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The tracks and tires have mass and parasitic drag. They will sap some power away from the machine. Were you digging in an pushing or plowing through the snow or were you riding on top? |
Brian in FABULOUS Utah
Member
Username: Brianprovo
Post Number: 46
Registered: 11-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 07:39 pm: |
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When travling I thought I was on top and going along fine, albeit slow. Then as I went up a particular hill I got stuck, I tried to back up and the tracks spun, tried to go forward and the tracks spun. Tried for a bit but just dug in more so got the winch out and pulled the Argo out. Maybe I'll have to do something like in this picture but chain is heavy, I've also seen a picture that where someone put strips of angle iron arcross the tracks as a sort of paddle. But I use the Argo on snowy days on the street outside the house and the chains or bars would be in the way and overkill. |
Ron Hutt
Intermediate Member
Username: Ron
Post Number: 53
Registered: 12-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 08:17 pm: |
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Brian
I think that adding the chains will only create more track and tire spin and power loss. If you had the machine stuck by digging in I don't think chains or angle iron will get you on top. After looking at the posts I think the couple of posts about the cluthes might be worth a look.
on another thought? Out of curiousity did you ever try backing up the hill? I wonder if it might have been a weight or snow condition issue. I almost had the Avenger stuck in a bad spot but spun it around and was able to get back on top of the snow. |
Brian in FABULOUS Utah
Member
Username: Brianprovo
Post Number: 47
Registered: 11-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 08:44 pm: |
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I have not tried backing up the hill but by the time I could have thought of it - it was too late. Could not move forward or backward. I know it was a snow condition with it being slick snow. I just want to overcome it. Those dang Rhinos did!
I did email you Ron. |
Brad Morcom
Member
Username: Evil1
Post Number: 30
Registered: 02-2007
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 09:29 pm: |
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Beat by a Rhino? OOOOoooh that hurts. Spare no expense!!! Buy a set of rubber tracks and tune-up that conquest. You'll be able to drag that damn Rhino all over the hills. |
Brian in FABULOUS Utah
Member
Username: Brianprovo
Post Number: 48
Registered: 11-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, January 07, 2008 - 11:26 pm: |
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Ron, I emailed you @ ronhuttncservices@wildblue.net Is that still your email? |
Ron Hutt
Intermediate Member
Username: Ron
Post Number: 55
Registered: 12-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, January 08, 2008 - 10:17 am: |
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Hi Brian
I replied to your e-mail several days ago using the same address you sent. You might check your anti-virus or junk mail boxes. Mine won't allow unknown address in the system unless I allow it.
Ron |
Chris Chwaz
Member
Username: Buffalomax
Post Number: 26
Registered: 03-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 12, 2008 - 08:48 am: |
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I was Thinking,Has anyone compared the weight of the front tire put on the ground in a buffalo vs,a frontier.I know in my buffalo I am sitting way up front,while in my max 2 Iam sitting back like 9 inches,this has to make a differnce when going threw snow.I got tracks (tru tracks) on the buffalo,but my max cant take the tracks its the smallest max 2 with the hollow axles.I was looking at the new argo frontier thinking this would be the best one of these to go threw deep snow having to climb up and around in my woods ,doing our sugaring in february,and march snow.I like anyone who has a frontier to tell me what the think of it.Or should I get a newer Max2 whith the rubber tracks?Has anyone drove up on a scale with a max or buffalo or any argo,which one is the heavier at the front two wheels. |
Ed Pedro
Member
Username: Rosed
Post Number: 22
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, January 14, 2008 - 09:58 pm: |
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I have a 2005 conquest with the 18' tracks and never had an issue in deep snow, but if the hills are icy, the plastic tracks just slip, I installed the argo ice cleats but i find they don't make a difference because they are on the edge of the tracks. |
Brian in FABULOUS Utah
Member
Username: Brianprovo
Post Number: 49
Registered: 11-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, January 15, 2008 - 05:50 pm: |
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Well Ed that is good to know as that was something I was thinking about doing. You saved me the trouble. |
Ed Pedro
Member
Username: Rosed
Post Number: 23
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, January 17, 2008 - 09:17 pm: |
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a couple of weeks ago I actually studded the track with 1/2 inch hex head self tapping screws, just like the old studs they used to use for snowmobile tracks, and I found it made a slight difference, so I'm going to add more, especially right down the center of the track were the weight is. I'll let you know the results. |
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