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Big Wolf
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:39 pm: | 
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This is a subject that needs some very serious discussion feed back by every one!
I have spent several days trying ot further educate myself about the different types of Motorcyle and ATV drive chain available out there on the market, and also the different types of metal matrials that they are made of, including the variuos tensil strengths and so on.
There are some very interesting things to learn and know about chains. I even read a couple of subject matter expert type advisories suggesting that the basic mild steel O-Ring chain is really no better than standard mild steel non O-Ring type chain. Irregarless of which of these two chain types you choose, you really will not see any longer life out of a piece of chain, if both are maintained the same way and frequency. Both will stretch the same amount because they are made of mild steel and the tensil strengths are very close also. This brings about the question, why pay a lot more cash for some thing that really is not any better!
It seems that if you want to make any kind of substantial step forward in chain life, you need to step up into a chain that is made of a chrome moly material which actually has a higher tensile strength and reduced elastic properties as compared to a mild steel chain.
The ultimate step up seems to be a titanium material chain and matching titanium sprockets, however the cost is about three times more just for the chain alone, not to mention the cost for custom sprockets.
There is also a new breed of chain out which is known as X-Ring chain. They claim that the X-Ring chain is major advancement in chain technology, it seems to be build stronger, higher tensil strength, improved seal design to keep the lubricant inside better and so on.
There are many chain manufacturers and specialty suppliers available on the internet these days, so I may list some links to their web sites on later postings.
When I spoke with the R.I. factory about this subject of chains, and what the expected usefull life of O-Ring chain that you can expect to see. Their response ranges from 300 hours to 1500 hours, depending on who you speek with of course. Tech support starts at about 300 hours and sales swings as high as 1500 hours. The only thing that I can say is Wow!
It would be nice to here from other people that are actually using the different types of chain products, and here what their experiences are with their machine applications. |
Midwest atv's #1 since 2000 (Hustler)
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:39 pm: |
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I can only speak of my experience with the chains and I think the O-ring chains are much better. They don't stretch at much and as fast as regular chains. Now as far as how long they last, I really don't know. I know the regular chains don't seem to last more then 100 to 200 hours. I have worked on some Max's that had 300 to 500 hours on the o-rings chains and they still look good. Worked on one that had close to 1000 hours and it still looked good. Now is it worth the extra money, I don't know. |
Big Wolf
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:39 pm: |
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Below is a listing of a few of the chain manufacturers and suppliers web sites that I have checked out recently. You have to ignore some of the product promo stuff written by the factory team sponsored racing guys. I say this because the sponsored racing teams get all their stuff for free in mist cases, and are paid to say what ever they are told to say.
Some of the chain manufacturers do not do a good job of providing more in depth specification information of what materials their chains are made of either, example mild steel, carbon steel or chrome moly steel, etc. If the materials used is indeed mild steel, then the chain will stretch like an (SOB), until they are trashed. If the chain is made of a good quality carbon steel or chrome moly steel then they will have a much reduced elastic property, and will not stretch nearly as much as a mild steel type chain. The titanium chain reallt caught my attention, because a single strand #50 size chain has a tensil strength of about 14,000 lbs and will not stretch or wear out nearly as fast as a mild steel chain. The cost of a set of titanium chains will run probably about $1,500 or more.
Chain Manufacturers;
D.I.D. Chain; http://www.didchain.com
Diamond Chain Company; http://www.diamondchain.com
RK Chain; http://rk-excel.co.jp
Tsubaki Motorcyle Chain; http://www.tsubakimoto.com
Sindewinder Racing; http://www.sidewindersprockets.com
Montec Motorcycle Chain; http://www.montecdirect.com
Grainger Industrial Supply; http://www.grainger.com
Shoup Manufacturing; http://www.shoupparts.com
Interesting Chain Facts and Maintenance Info.
http://www.quality-cycle.com/truth_about_motorcycle_chains.htm
http://www.best-motorcycle-chain-lube.com/Chain%20Maint.htm
Hopefully all of these web site links work correctly, if not, you should be able locate them, by doing an internet search using the address string provided.
One more thing; I do belive that R.I. is currently using the 520 and 530 size Tsubaki Sigma O-Ring chain on all of the new Max products. The Tsubaki chain seems to be a good quality chain, and does have a some waht higher specified tensil strength compared to most other brands of chain. I do not know what brand, type, and exact sizes of chains that Argo is currently using on their products. Maybe some of the experienced Argo guys can shed more light on this information. |
Big Wolf
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:39 pm: |
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Hey guys I posted more on this topic thinking that it generate a lot more interest and discussion! Besides it is a good time to get off the subject of the current state of the Max dealership thing! |
TBudzo
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:39 pm: |
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Stretch is an issue but from my experience much of the wear is due to the pins inside the rollers wearing. Lay a used chain on the ground and push the ends of a section a foot long toward each other then pull them apart. You can see the play beetween the pins and rollers compared to a new chain. That is where the o ring chain chain helps, it helps keep lube on the pins and dirt out. Of course better metal will help also as the pins will wear less. |
Big Wolf
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:39 pm: |
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Both DID and RK chain companies make that new type of X-Ring chain. I am curious if any one has tried any of that stuff yet. It looks like some interesting stuff. I also noticed that Sidewinder Racing claims to have a more robust made chain product with oversized pins and so on, but they do not list the technical specifications of their stuff, so you can't easily compare it and verify waht they calim for your self. |
dt5428
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:39 pm: |
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Hey Big Wolf maybe you guys need to take a different angle on the chain problems you are encountering.I have not owned my Argo long but have had many motorcycles and atv's and as long as you keep the chain tight clean and lubed they last a very long time.It sounds to me like everyone is running out of chain adjustment maybe this is the area you should investigate.Maybe there is a way to add a chain guide somewhere and take up some of the slack allowing you to get more chain adjustments or maybe making you own adjustment point or altering the existing adjustment points.Like I said I am not up on the Max and not sure how much room you have to play with.Just wanted to maybe give you another angle to think about tunnel vision sometimes gets us all.Then again it may not even be possible.
Later,Dan |
Big Wolf
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:39 pm: |
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I hear you Dan! It is easy to get tunnel vision when you are working on solving technical issues. You have some very good thought ideas regarding new and innovative chain tensioner and take up designs. I have been thinking about that same subject here lately. If it was not for the advisory against adjusting the chain to tight, I would make up a small gas spring cylinder type of auto adjust and take up device, or a die spring loaded take up and that would solve the mauanl adjusting thing once an that you work on |
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