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Harry Dusseau (Dirtyharry)
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:54 pm: | 
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PLEASE READ AND RESPOND TO THIS! THANKS!
I'm curious as to how other AATV owners across the country fair with regards to laws governing where they can ride and what they must (or are unable) to register their machines as.
Here in Michigan, the legal deck is defiinately stacked against us amphibbers. Our laws for state trail acceptable "ATVs" list a maximum vehicle width of 52". Guess what? Max & Argos are both somewhere around (or over) 56". No big deal, right? You bet, until you run into some anal-retentive DNR a$$hole with a fresh ticketbook and an axe to grind. Fines are a certainty, and repossession of your beloved AATV is a definate possiblity. (I realize that not all DNR officers are a-holes, and I apologize to the three of you who aren't (HA!). That said, I always seem to encounter the ones who ARE!)
Every AATV owner out there owes it to himself/herself to start a grassroots campaign to update stale, old laws. All states with outdated laws & amphib-prejudiced ATV definitions (and I'm guessing most are) need to get the books re-written. Contact your local public servant (politician) and see what can be done about it.
I don't know how feasible it is, but maybe pushing for a national definition of just what an ATV is might (or might not) be a good idea. I realize that getting big government involved in this problem could potentially be worse than simply remaining "invisible." Thoughts on this??? |
jerry
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:54 pm: |
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Maybe we should consider the "Passive Aggressive" approach, kinda like those wackos @ GreenPeace. Taunt the DNR until they write you up or worse. Then go public to the news media and everyone else about how they harrassed you so badly just because you wanted to teach your kids about nature and the great outdoors from the safety of your ATV. Carry on about how they conspired against you just because your machine was 2 inches over the government imposed width restriction. Point out the incredible amount of tax dollars wasted to bring you into the "Halls of Justice" while the real criminals are still selling crack on the street corners -in broad daylight. Be sure to appeal any action to the court system and stretch every bit of publicity out of it. Tell the media that you have to represent yourself in court because you can't afford a lawyer and since it's not a criminal case the courts won't appoint one to you. The next day the lawyers will be standing in line to help you. Only give the media enough info each time to keep them interested and to keep them coming back. If you give it all to them at once, you've blown your load, they get bored and move on to new news. Also get your state reps. senators, and the governor involved. As soon as the politicians see the media coverage, they'll either flock to support you or try to distance themselves from you. If the latter, then explain to the media how you begged for help from your politicians and they refused to help a decent family loving, baseball playing, hotdog & apple pie eating American in your fight against the tyranny of the socialistic robotic like sub-human bureaucrats at the DNR. Lastly get the quad guys, snow mobilers, hunters, and fishermen on your side. Explain to them that if the DRN succeeds against you, they're probably next. This would be true grassroots. Only question now is "Who is willing to be the martyr". |
Tim Mueller
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:54 pm: |
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Harry, you are right on the money with your grass roots idea. Here's a legal and VERY effective way to start: Most people have no idea who their congressman is, let alone who their state legislators are. It's pretty easy to find out by just checking your own State's web site (and they all have one). Get all your friends involved who share your (our) views on the tyrannical laws imposed on using AATV on 'public' (I just wonder what government's definition of 'public' is...?) lands. Be damn sure they have all their facts straight regarding the laws, nothing discredits a cause quicker that someone going off on a rant who doesn't know what he's talking about. Once everyone is on the same sheet of music, you start an e-mail campaign to your lawmakers. One or two here and there from the same two people aren't going to do any good, there has to be a sustained campaign from at least 6 to 10 people. Do not use (no matter how much they deserve it) vulgar or obscene language, as that discredits you as well.
A lobbyist friend of mind tells me that politicians view ONE letter or e-mail they receive as representing 3000 people with the same points of view. So there is power in numbers, get as many people involved as possible. If you had 20 friends (to a vote hungry politician 20 equals 60,000!) who e-mailed your legislators every other week for three months, you WILL see action. They might not be able to do everything you want, but you won't get anything without trying. It sure worked here in Oregon in changing some of our muzzle loading hunting laws! We're fortunate in Oregon to have (mostly) more common-sense laws regarding AATV's, so it doesn't sound like we share the same problem on that....yet. |
MaxRules (Brandon_price)
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:54 pm: |
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I have already began writing letters to Finger Lakes State Park. They are listening but I am not gaining any ground yet. They did tell me that the AMA (American Motorcyclists Association) sets the rules that most "public" ORV places follow. I think we all need to email the AMA for them to change what they think is an ATV. Their web site is www.ama-cycle.com . Scroll to the very bottom and click E-mail Directory. This will bring up a very long list of email addresses to AMA. I think the ones we should email are these:
1. Administration, President
Robert Rasor rrasor@ama-cycle.org
2. Government relations, Legislative Affairs Specialist (Off-Road Issues)
Royce Wood rwood@ama-cycle.org
I already have a good letter typed that I sent to Finger Lakes. If someone on here has excellent letter writing ability and is persuasive you need to write a letter and send it to us, so we can then email or mail it to where it needs to go.
Succeeding in this will not only give us more land to ride on, but will also improve the popularity of 6x6s. Although I would never choose a lesser vehicle, some people may be deterred by the fact they can't ride a 6x6 on "public" lands.
6x6s will rule again. |
pete6x6
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:54 pm: |
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Brandon,
I agree wholeheartedly. As a member of the ama I can write to my local chapter and ask them why they make these rules. They seem to be more apt to listen to members then non-members so I think this can get us somewhere. |
Harry Dusseau (Dirtyharry)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:54 pm: |
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Pete-
If the AMA actually does set the basic guidelines which states find easy to adopt into their descriptions for ATV's on the lawbooks, then contacting the AMA for help is the best first step. Pete, you are absolutely right about them paying more attention to a memeber than an "outsider" when an issue is brought before them. If you could see to it to contact someone there, please do. If you get any response back, bad or good, let us know. Perhaps we can get the AMA hooked into a grassroots re-write. I'm not kidding myself that it's gonna happen like magic overnight, but if it even affects one or two states, that may be enough to get the snowball effect rolling.
FIGHT ON TO RIDE ON!!!
Harry |
dave c (Davec)
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:54 pm: |
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I live in maryland and don't have a 6x6 yet but I am working on it. What do I need to do to ride on state property. Someone told me about getting a sticker. Does anyone know anything about this and or how is it in your state? So now if I get stopped by the DNR, he'll be taking out his yard stick and calculater, right. Dave |
pete6x6
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:54 pm: |
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Dave,
I live in Maryland also. You need a sticker present on your atv to ride on public orv trails. This is another item I have not gotten to yet. I have one for my klr 250 kawasaki street and trail but I'm not sure if they have restrictions on size and/or weight they didn't ask when I got the last one. I would assume if they have these guidelines the dnt office will ask what type of atv it is and more than likely fine you if they see fit. I'll have to call the congressman here to see what the law really is. I'll post soon what I find out. |
pete6x6
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:54 pm: |
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Dave,
Oh and btw greenridge mountain park is a nice place to ride. Check it out. |
Ernie Savinsky (Lucky45)
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:54 pm: |
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GW will let us drink beer and ride our aatv on white house lawn and in that big pond by Washington monument. Lets have a ride to DC to state our case for freedom to ride!!!!!
Write,call, fax,e-mail,etc all they(DEC lawmakers, etc) want is to take registration money and give us no place to ride. |
dave c (Davec)
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:54 pm: |
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Pete, Dave here. I guess it will be a while before I go riding my 6x6. I will check out greenridge park in the near future. Thanks.. Dave |
Lazerman (Lazerman)
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Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:54 pm: |
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Dave
I also live in Maryland. I called Greenridge last week and they sent me the application for a sticker. It's very short and only costs $15.00 for a year. They even sent a map. Anyone interested in going to Greenridge let me know, I have two extra applications and plan on going sometime soon.
Brad |
pete@min.net
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:54 pm: |
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Dave and Brad,
Count me in! I'm trying desperately to finish my Attex asap. The cold is getting to me due to the fact I have to do most of my frame off outside in the cold. I've never had grease freeze on my gloves till now but it was damn cold yesterday I think about 10 degrees where I was. I have the frame almost out I'm struggling with two of the axles one is bent in the front which I will have to replace. Hey Richard got any Axles for Attex? |
pete6x6
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:54 pm: |
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Dave and Brad,
Think we can start a 6x6 club in maryland I mean we have three so far :) |
Acadia
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:54 pm: |
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I live in Nova Scotia, Canada. We have a lot of atv clubs. For ten bucks a year I can register my big foot as a six wheeled ATV in the province. The province issues a licence plate about half the size of a car plate with a place to update the sticker anualy. Most gov't land is accsesible except for provincial or national parks. The plate allows us to cross provincial roads to continue along the trail you are on. On occasion we'll meet the Department of Natural Resourses or the Royal Canadian Mounted Police. They don't usually bother us if we're wearing a helmet and our plate and sticker checks. Usually they are more interested in getting an Argo and checking mine out!
They have zero tolorance on alcohol, if they catch ya they will fine you on the spot, dump you're bottles and escort you out of the woods
cheers:
Acadia |
jkmep22
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 23, 2005 - 10:54 pm: |
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Harry,
I also live in Michigan and ride my Attex. Did you know that if you put tracks on your 6x6 you must have it registered as a snowmobile? Stupid hey but its the states way of getting another $16 out of ya. If you use the machine in the water as a boat (fishing, joy riding) it must have a watercraft license. What I don't understand it that the same trail the snowmobiles use the ATV's use but the 6x6 can't. Most snowmobiles are over 56" wide..Kemp |
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