Subtopic	Posts		Updated
	Archive through December 10, 2000	9

By Steven A. Makitra (Slammy) on Unrecorded Date: Edit

Yeah no kidding! I had to pull out a 2001 Toyota Tundra with my 2001 MAXIV (18hpBriggs)uphill, in a foot of snow last week. Now I'm here to tell ya...That's a lotta Rice!!! It really DOES NOT matter how much power you have if you do not get it to the ground! It was a bitter pill for the Kamakazie pilot, but he will live another day to get stuck again. He asked for it....He got it!
Slammy

By Dave Johnston on Unrecorded Date: Edit

Well, hate to admit it, but I rolled my Argo Conquest! Coming down a hill, avoiding late spring snow drifts, I came upon a narrow place between two rocks. I put the right wheels on a 2 foot rock...and tried to turn right, around the rock. I tipped over. FORTUNATELY we had two other Argos with us and the crews were able to flip my machine back over with little effort. Only damage to the Argo was a broken windshield (down in the storage position.) No damage to wheels, axles, tires, sides, frame, seatbacks, stored canopy top, lights, engine cover etc. If I had not had the add-on windshield there would have been NO damage at all. It started right up after it was turned over and we continued on our way, as if nothing had happened. LESSON LEARNED: Argo Conquests are great, but can be pushed beyond their limit...specially when TILT and TURN are combined. I should have put the LEFT wheels on the other rock and then turned right. (My thanks to Don and Pat of Carson City.)

By Russell Lee (Bigkodiak) on Unrecorded Date: Edit

Dave
I rolled my Bigfoot in Mona's mud hole, up at the last Humphrey ride. Although I was not hurt (other than pride) the machine got a ton of mud in it, tearing up the chains.
The point is that I failed to recognize the severity of the situation I was in. I was trying to go what felt like stright up out of the hole. When the front of the machine started to slide to the left I felt I was still OK. Then the left side tires hit a rut and it was all over.
I later learned that someone rolled a MAX IV with their whole family in the same hole. Luckily no one was hurt with them either.
Sometimes we all forget that these machines aren't invincible.

By David Keeso (Argomag) on Unrecorded Date: Edit

The name of this section is ROLLOVERS CAN HURT. This is very true. I don't like to admit it, but I rolled the ARGO this last weekend. Their was a power loss on Friday night and I couldn't explain why. The engine just started revving down slowly and by pulling the choke out, it got the power back. The engine was already warmed up and the engine oil temp gauge was above the 250 mark. I took it back home and the next day, went out with my sister, and her friend. They are 13, I am 17 and have been driving the ARGO since I was 8. I know almost everything thier is to know about driving an ARGO. I was going down the road with them and the power started draining again. It was slowing down and I went to turn to go back home. I couldn't get it into a skid to turn so I made a wide arc. halfway through, the power surged back into it, and I either paniced, and jerked the left brake, or I fell back and jerked the brake but the next thing I knew, my sister and friend were screaming, and the ARGO was on top of me. They got out but I was pinned under it and I was only able to move my left arm. I shut the engine off and waited for help. Withing i think about 3 minutes, someone was there and was able to lift up the ARGO enough that I could undo the seatbelt and get out from under it. We were all cut and badly brused but no serious injuries. The argo is fine, engine sounds bad but no body damage.

What I think happened was that when I jerked the brake, the right side tires caught on the pavement and flipped it clockwise on top of me. It rolled left over right and I was now under the passenger side. (I think). The road was dead flat, no loose graval, but hardtoped or paved. It was very painful, and scared the shit out of me but the next day, I built up the courage to start up the ARGO and drive it to the end of the driveway to put the garbage out. It won't be run again until theri is a good rollbar on it and the power surge has been solved.

The moral, Rollovers can hurt alot.

By argogeru on Unrecorded Date: Edit

David,
I would not suggest using seatbelts without a roll bar/cage. If you do roll without a roll bar, you can most of the time get thrown or bail out of the way of the machine, I have seen it happen before. If you are strapped in without a roll bar and roll down A hill, you might as well kiss it goodby. I dont know about your case, but you may have been thrown clear, before the machine came rolling over. Glad you are okay, and grease the tires before you turn on pavement again!!...

By David Keeso (Argomag) on Unrecorded Date: Edit

In my case, it did roll over me. I was stuck under it for a few minutes with most of the machines weight on me. (very painful) What do you mean by greasing the tires?

By David Keeso (Argomag) on Unrecorded Date: Edit

Any Idea what would cause the power loss i mentioned in my last post?

By ISAAC EISENMAN (Tropicjungleboy) on Unrecorded Date: Edit

HEY ARGOMAG:

according to what you mention looks like your engine get out of fuel or overheating...

so check for the follow areas:

* the cooling system....does the cooling air intake is clear???
does the cooling fan cover stay on place??
does the cylinder head air duct is on place??
does ventilation port on upper body are clean??

* the gasoline side:
does the gasoline filter have enough fuel flow??
does all fuel line are secured to conection ports (to avoid suction leak)
does gasoline is mixed with water???

happy searching!!!

By argogeru on Unrecorded Date: Edit

david,
sarcasm. greased tires would make them slippery as to turn on pavement without rolling.

By bigkodiak on Unrecorded Date: Edit

David
I think the grease on the tires was a joke since AATV's don't turn well on pavement.
Your power loss problem could be fuel starvation, carb problem, fuel pump, electrical, spark plug or a number of other items.
Russ

By David Keeso (Argomag) on Unrecorded Date: Edit

Thank you all. I thought about the fuel line problem but how can it be clogged if the the gas going in is clean? Would this cause surges of power through the engine? As far as I'm concerned, ARGO's suck at turning on any hard surface where they can't skid easily. Those runnasucks are also crap. Anyone have a softer tire i could try and use.

By David Keeso (Argomag) on Unrecorded Date: Edit

In addition, the argo manuals say strictly for off road use. I think this proves why it says that very clearly. I am just glad the argo is still in one peace and I am not dead

By Ted on Unrecorded Date: Edit

You may have a kink in a fuel line. Is it possible one of the kids was leaning on it. It also could be throttle linkage that is binding up. Are all your springs still there?

By Douglas MacCullagh (Dougmac) on Unrecorded Date: Edit

David - I had toruble with power drop-off, surges, and poor performance in my Vanguard2. It turned out to be problems with the Briggs & Stratton carburator and governor. The Briggs shop fixed it right up. Unfortunately, it would not stay fixed and required annual maintenance. Frankly, I am happier with the Runnamuck tires than I amd with the Briggs engines.

By David Keeso (Argomag) on Unrecorded Date: Edit

When the choke was pulled half way out, the engine would rev right up back to full power. However, this was the only way to stop the power loss. I didn't have it pulled when it rolled because it had lost power fast didn't want to run in to any other problems so I was trying to get home. This is the point where I turned, and it rolled when the power jolted back in.

By argogeru on Unrecorded Date: Edit

David,
I would bet it is the fuel filter, change that and I bet your problems will go away.

By Scott Philipps (Argosrus) on Unrecorded Date: Edit

i would adjust the mixture on the carb..sounds like ure running to lean, and not getting enough fule

By Roger Smith on Unrecorded Date: Edit

I've had lots of trouble with the fuel system in my Argo. Of all the stuff I've owned, lawn mowers, trimmers, boats, cars, cycles.. never did I have a problem with them after sitting, even over winter.

But the Vanguard in my Response might not start after sitting for 2 months. The fuel system would form this yellow looking gum... stop up the fuel filter, fuel pump, and carburetor. I'd have to change the filter, disassemble and clean the carb and fuel pump for it to run. The valve plates in the pump would stick shut.

I pulled the fuel tank out because the factory welded the tank locator tabs too close together for the tank to sit right, and noticed it was full of the gum/varnish. I rinsed it out with Berryman's Chemtool. I'm thinking it has something to do with the polyethylene the tank is made of.

The gum causes a lean mixture, power loss, rough idle, hesitation, (the kind where pulling the choke out helps)

With everything clean, the idle mixture limiter cap removed and set where it needs to be, the throttle linkage hooked direct and requiring less grip twist for full throttle, an electric fuel pump so it never starves on any incline... well it's a whole new vehicle. Starts instantly, idles perfectly, never falters or hesitates, good power.

I know Richard has an article warning about electric fuel pumps, so if you don't know what kind to buy and how to install, don't do it. But you can fix everything but the falter on steep inclines without the electric pump by cleaning the fuel system/pump/carb and removing the idle limiter cap, allowing mixture adjustment.

By david berger (Davidrrrd) on Unrecorded Date: Edit

yes roger it's that dam cheep ass reformulated gas,
it dosent last long at all,

By David Keeso (Argomag) on Unrecorded Date: Edit

Roger, This is the first time something like this has happened to me in the ARGO. I remember once the engine stalled gradually because of the fuel line a few years ago when my dad still drove it and not me. Since our ARGO MAGNUM sits for a long time between use because we aren't up at the cottage all the time, I woudn't be suprised if that gum stuff you were mentioning is in the tank. Although, if I can, i usually leave as little fuel in there if I am not going to be up for a while.

By mr. tinker on Unrecorded Date: Edit

you need to read up on the organism that lives in your fuel system. it clogs it up bigtime. maybe i can find some info on it and post a link.

By mike martindale (Wetsu) on Unrecorded Date: Edit

hey guy's
sorry to here about your roll david.but you are right they do hurt.i've had two myself,right side and backwards.neither were pleasent,or wanted.i now have a homade rollcage no seatbelts yet.not to sure i want to be trapped inside upside down.but both involved a hill of some sort.as far as apower surge i have never had one,i do get hesitation,and a lot of backfiring,mostly when i shut it off.they said it was the exhaust system.so we had it changed.the dealer said they made it to small,so they put on a bigger 1.i have also adjusted the carb,as much as i can.seems to help,also they ( john deere )has a fuel stabilizer,designed for the briggs.plastic tanks and all.sorry i can't remember the name of it,threw the bottle away.

By David Keeso (Argomag) on Unrecorded Date: Edit

Ya, still a little scared about the hole thing. I am not sure how much I really want to jump back in the ARGO and pick up where I left off, but as they say, Pick yourself up and try again. Although, i did, i went out the next day with the backrest bent all the way back and the left brake very screwed up. (it was engaging too quickly and was effortless to make any move to the left.) Although the ARGO MAGS were never really easy to turn, or any older ARGO if I am right, it turned like a brand new ARGO, effortless to turn.

However, it took a lot of effort to drag my sore self into it and run it.

It is being fixed now, the rollbar is going back on because i don't want to take any more chances. Considering that i was on dead flat ground, no hills in sight, and no area where the road dropped.

We originaly took the rollbar off because my dad was using it in his development that he is workign on and couldn't get through the bush. So now, it is going back on and If i can't get through the bush now, oh well. I am planning on gettign a custom made rollbar that is smaller and rounded so I can get through the bush easier.

By rayray71@aol.com on Unrecorded Date: Edit

have you checked to see how dirty your air filter is. i had eight max II's and had the same problem when the air filters would get clogged.take the filter off and see how it runs if it's better clean it or get a new one. hope this helps.

By David Keeso (Argomag) on Unrecorded Date: Edit

rayray71, were you talking to me??

IF you were, yes, the airfilter was semi blocked and their was water in the carb.

Another post under the vapor lock said that their max atv would stall out unless they ran at half choke. When mine rolled, i was slowly loosing power. The night before, i was driving down the river bank and started loosing power. After about 10 minutes, i had the throttle wide open and wasn't going more than 9 kph. I barely had enough power to get up a small embankment. It wasn't even a foot high, and it barely had enough power to climb it. I stopped on a flat dry spot and shut the engine off. My sister and her friend were in it also, I was sure we would have to walk home. I tried starting the engine and it wouldn't start. It sounded like a cold engine in need of the choke. I pulled the choke and it fired up right away. I had to drive with the choke half way out or it would stall again. WHen I went out the next day (the day it rolled,) it was fine until I went onto a main road with my sister and her friend and it started loosing power again. I turned around, and was headed back for the cottage. I pulled the choke a bit and got some power back so I decided to turn again and keep going to where I was origionally going. I started into the turn and I think it surged and I fell back and jerked (pretty f&#$ing hard) and that must have been enough for the tires to catch the pavement and flip it right over. My sister and friend got out, I was trapped under the drivers seat in the seatbelt. I couldn't get the seatbelt off because I was twisted and my right arm was under me, my left arm couldnt' reach the seatbelt. I was completely comfused and barely remember what it was like under it. My sister was trapped under the back section. The way it flipped was the left side over the right. It rolled clockwise (i think) so as she was on the right side, it just rolled on top of her, and she was protected by the space between the road and teh floor. she was barely injured and crawled out where the outboard motor bracket was. She was just terrified. Her friend, was on the left adn was thrown out and she kept crawling on the road and just barely missed the argo hitting her on the way down. They tried to get me out but I couldn't get the seatbelt undone. If I could, i would have likely been able to get out. I couldn't feel my right arm, but it wasn't broken. I thought i had a gash in my head because I was laying in blood. I soon realized, I had a nosebleed at the same time.

Anyways, enough rambling, their was stuff in the filter and water in the carb. It is fixed now and the next time I used it after it rolled, and was fixed, the clutch against the firewall split and a piece of the metal smashed the oil temp gague and the whole vehicle started to shutter and shake.

Now, it is fully fixed and working as best it could be.

By MAXimum power on Unrecorded Date: Edit

ill bet none of you can top my roll over! i was going uo a 1/4 mile 35-40 degree slope, and i almost go to the when my little max (old, not shure what year) wit a small bush an bucked up into the air. it spun 270 degrees and started to roll. I bailed, but the thing just kept going. it rolled, and rolled, and rolled.....etc.... when it finally stopped, i saw 2 tires at 90 degree angles to where they normaly are, and all the axles were badly bent. the bottom hull was cracked, and the engine cover was a little mangled. i poped the hood to check her out, and i couldnt believe it. the engine was almost completely loose inside it compartment.
i was sad that my machine was totaled, but glad no one was hurt (good thing i bailed, you couldnt have even noticed that there used to be a roll cage). so i went out and got a new (used) max4 and swear that i will conquor that hill this year.!!!

By David Keeso (Argomag) on Unrecorded Date: Edit

I don't know if this tops it, but when I rolled our ARGO, I was trapped under it with the entire vehicle weight supported on my shoulder, I was crumpled up underneath and couldn't breathe very well. It was short lived though as the only damage was a small scraped area on the left of the machine and the seat was bent back, about 20 minutes worth of work to fix it up. It turned out that their was water in the carb and the fuel had been contaminated with something and it plugged the gas line up so it was getting spurts of gas and choking out, and then the power would surge through it. Terry SUgg took it and serviced it and checked it over twice and put our old rollbar back on. It is a very thick bar, and has been tested on a rolling ARGO in the past (not the current one, but my dads first one) When we went back up a month later, the cluth exploded and a piece of metal of the shiny part smashed my temp gauge and the vehicle (running at full throttle on an empty road due to construction at the cottage) decided to shutter and then it jurked to one side. Luckly, a neighbor of mine was driving by and picked me up and Terry was just a mile or so up the road.

By jim on Unrecorded Date: Edit

Two years ago I was doing dumb stuff on the on as i gave it the gas,I was gonna do a big power slide. As I was going forward but sliced over river, things like downutss. When that got booring the people that were ridding with me held iding sidways the max Iv. hit a ice pot hole and it fliped on its side, the rollbar paid for its self that day. We piled out and looked at the max on its side. we went to right it, we each grabed a section and lifted to put it back on all 6 wheels, the guy on the end broke through the ice and went down ,I jumped into the max which just tipt back on all six and the other guy ran twords shor. the ice didn't break any more then where the end guy was .Luckly it was only waste deep. I cut the trip short and now we all look back and laugh. sorry about the bad spelling